Talk:World War II

Semi-protected edit request on 13 January 2025

Please add « General Charles de Gaulle » with the main Allies leaders and France into the five World War II biggest winners. It’s a historical fact. Even if France lost the Battle of France, the Free France and the French Resistance went on the fight until 1945. Their participation was important in the Western Front. Of course, without the others Allies, France never won the War. — Preceding unsigned comment added by TanguyWilly (talk • contribs) 15:14, 13 January 2025 (UTC)

This has already been discussed quite a few times it seems, you can find the discussions by searching for him in the archives. TylerBurden (talk) 20:45, 13 January 2025 (UTC)

The lead is too long - here are my suggested edits

While MOS:LEADLENGTH is not prescriptive, it recommends that leads not be so long that readers are intimidated by them or lose interest. The current lead is almost a full A4 page, which I'd suggest is excessive, though probably not dramatically so. I'd suggest the following lightly revised version to get the length down a bit. In doing so, I've looked for easy wins, especially by removing unneeded details such as who declared war when when this is obvious from the other text. I'd be grateful for views and further edits - there's a case for more dramatic editing to get this to the general norm of 3-4 shortish paras. Perhaps the most controversial element of the below is omitting a mention of Hitler's suicide: my rationale here is that both Ian Keershaw (author of the standard biography of Hitler), Richard E. Evans and some other historians state that Hitler's suicide was inconsequential by the time it occurred given that Germany had been totally destroyed so it doesn't seem significant enough to mention; we (rightly) don't mention the killing of Mussolini or FDR's death either. Nick-D (talk) 10:20, 15 January 2025 (UTC)

World War II or the Second World War (1 September 1939 – 2 September 1945) was a global conflict between two coalitions: the Allies and the Axis powers. Nearly all the world's countries —including all the great powers—participated, with many investing all available economic, industrial, and scientific capabilities in pursuit of total war, blurring the distinction between military and civilian resources. Tanks and aircraft played major roles, with the latter enabling the strategic bombing of population centres and delivery of the only two nuclear weapons ever used in war. World War II was the deadliest conflict in history, resulting in 70 to 85 million deaths, more than half being civilians. Millions died in genocides, including the Holocaust of European Jews, as well as from massacres, starvation, and disease. Following the Allied powers' victory, Germany, Austria, Japan, and Korea were occupied, and war crimes tribunals were conducted against German and Japanese leaders.

The causes of World War II included unresolved tensions in the aftermath of World War I and the rise of fascism in Europe and militarism in Japan. Key events leading up to the war included Japan's invasion of Manchuria, the Spanish Civil War, the outbreak of the Second Sino-Japanese War, and Germany's annexations of Austria and the Sudetenland. World War II is generally considered to have begun on 1 September 1939, when Nazi Germany, under Adolf Hitler, invaded Poland, prompting the United Kingdom and France to declare war on Germany. Poland was divided between Germany and the Soviet Union under the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact, in which they had agreed on "spheres of influence" in Eastern Europe. In 1940, the Soviets annexed the Baltic states and parts of Finland and Romania. After the fall of France in June 1940, the war continued mainly between Germany and the British Empire, with fighting in the Balkans, Mediterranean, and Middle East, the aerial Battle of Britain and the Blitz, and naval Battle of the Atlantic. Through a series of campaigns and treaties, Germany took control of much of continental Europe and formed the Axis alliance with Italy, Japan, and other countries. In June 1941, Germany led the European Axis in an invasion of the Soviet Union, opening the Eastern Front and initially making large territorial gains.

Japan aimed to dominate East Asia and the Asia-Pacific, and by 1937 was at war with the Republic of China. In December 1941, Japan attacked American and British territories in Southeast Asia and the Central Pacific, including Pearl Harbor in Hawaii, which resulted in the US and the UK declaring war against Japan, and The European Axis also declared war on the US. Japan conquered much of coastal China and Southeast Asia, but its advances in the Pacific were halted in mid-1942 after its defeat in the naval Battle of Midway. In late 1942, Germany and Italy were defeated in North Africa and at Stalingrad in the Soviet Union. Events in 1943—including German defeats on the Eastern Front, the Allied invasion of Italy, and Allied offensives in the Pacific—forced the Axis into retreat on all fronts. In 1944, the Western Allies invaded occupied France at Normandy and the Soviet Union recaptured its lost territory. In the Pacific, the Allies crippled Japan's navy and captured key islands.

The war in Europe concluded with the liberation of German-occupied territories; the invasion of Germany by the Western Allies and the Soviet Union, culminating in the fall of Berlin to Soviet troops; Hitler's suicide; and the German unconditional surrender on 8 May 1945. Following the refusal of Japan to surrender on the terms of the Potsdam Declaration, the US dropped the first atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki on 6 and 9 August. Faced with an imminent invasion of the Japanese archipelago, the possibility of further atomic bombings, and the Soviet declaration of war against Japan and its invasion of Manchuria, Japan announced its unconditional surrender on 15 August and signed a surrender document on 2 September 1945, marking the end of the war.

World War II changed the political alignment and social structure of the world, and it set the foundation of international relations for the rest of the 20th century and into the 21st century. The United Nations was established to foster international cooperation and prevent conflicts, with the victorious great powers—China, France, the Soviet Union, the UK, and the US—becoming the permanent members of its security council. The Soviet Union and the United States emerged as rival superpowers, setting the stage for the Cold War. In the wake of European devastation, the influence of its great powers waned, triggering the decolonisation of Africa and Asia. Most countries whose industries had been damaged moved towards economic recovery and expansion.

Nick-D (talk) 10:16, 15 January 2025 (UTC)

Further suggested cuts:

World War II or the Second World War (1 September 1939 – 2 September 1945) was a global conflict between two coalitions: the Allies and the Axis powers. Nearly all the world's countries —including all the great powers—participated, with many investing all available economic, industrial, and scientific capabilities in pursuit of total war, blurring the distinction between military and civilian resources. Tanks and aircraft played major roles, with the latter enabling the strategic bombing of population centres and delivery of the only two nuclear weapons ever used in war. World War II was the deadliest conflict in history, resulting in 70 to 85 million deaths, more than half being civilians. Millions died in genocides, including the Holocaust of European Jews, as well as and from massacres, starvation, and disease. Following the Allied powers' victory, Germany, Austria, Japan, and Korea were occupied, and war crimes tribunals were conducted against German and Japanese leaders.

The causes of World War II included unresolved tensions in the aftermath of World War I and the rise of fascism in Europe and militarism in Japan. Key events leading up to the war included Japan's invasion of Manchuria, the Spanish Civil War, the outbreak of the Second Sino-Japanese War, and Germany's annexations of Austria and the Sudetenland. World War II is generally considered to have begun on 1 September 1939, when Nazi Germany, under Adolf Hitler, invaded Poland, prompting the United Kingdom and France to declare war on Germany. Poland was divided between Germany and the Soviet Union under the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact, in which they had agreed on "spheres of influence" in Eastern Europe. In 1940, the Soviets annexed the Baltic states and parts of Finland and Romania. After the fall of France in June 1940, the war continued mainly between Germany and the British Empire, with fighting in the Balkans, Mediterranean, and Middle East, the aerial Battle of Britain and the Blitz, and naval Battle of the Atlantic. Through a series of campaigns and treaties, Germany took control of much of continental Europe and formed the Axis alliance with Italy, Japan, and other countries. In June 1941, Germany led the European Axis in an invasion of the Soviet Union, opening the Eastern Front and initially making large territorial gains.

Japan aimed to dominate East Asia and the Asia-Pacific, and by 1937 was at war with the Republic of China. In December 1941, Japan attacked American and British territories in Southeast Asia and the Central Pacific, including Pearl Harbor in Hawaii, which resulted in the US and the UK declaring war against Japan, and . The European Axis also declared war on the US. Japan conquered much of coastal China and Southeast Asia, but its advances in the Pacific were halted in mid-1942 after its defeat in the naval Battle of Midway. In late 1942, Germany and Italy were defeated in North Africa and at Stalingrad in the Soviet Union. Events in 1943—including German defeats on the Eastern Front, the Allied invasion of Italy, and Allied offensives in the Pacific—forced the Axis into retreat on all fronts. In 1944, the Western Allies invaded occupied France at Normandy and the Soviet Union recaptured its lost territory. In the Pacific, the Allies crippled Japan's navy and captured key islands.

The war in Europe concluded with the liberation of German-occupied territories; the Allied invasion of Germany by the Western Allies and the Soviet Union, culminating in the fall of Berlin to Soviet troops; Hitler's suicide; and the German unconditional surrender on 8 May 1945. Following the refusal of Japan to surrender on the terms of the Potsdam Declaration, the US dropped the first atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki on 6 and 9 August. Faced with an imminent invasion of the Japanese archipelago, the possibility of further atomic bombings, and. The Soviet declared war against Japan and its invaded Manchuria.Japan announced its unconditional surrender on 15 August and signed a surrender document on 2 September 1945, marking the end of the war.

World War II changed the political alignment and social structure of the world, and it set the foundation of international relations for the rest of the 20th century and into the 21st century. The United Nations was established to foster international cooperation and prevent conflicts, with the victorious great powers—China, France, the Soviet Union, the UK, and the US becoming the permanent members of its security council. The Soviet Union and the United States emerged as rival superpowers, setting the stage for the Cold War. In the wake of European devastation, the influence of its great powers waned, triggering the decolonisation of Africa and Asia. Most countries whose industries had been damaged moved towards economic recovery and expansion."

Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 22:12, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

with many investing all available economic, industrial, and scientific capabilities in pursuit of total war — this seems a bit weak.--Jack Upland (talk) 02:04, 17 January 2025 (UTC)

I support the proposed changes of Aemilius Adolphin, with the exception of the mention of the major roles played by tanks, aircraft, and strategic bombing, which I think are significant enough to mention. The mention of nuclear weapons can be saved for later in the lead. I also think that these cuts would enable a removal of the line break between the third and fourth paragraphs. — Goszei (talk) 18:38, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

I'd agree with keeping the mention of tanks/aircraft/strategic bombing, and also think we should keep "Japan aimed to dominate East Asia and the Pacific and the the details of Japan's surrender. I think Faced with an imminent invasion of Japan, the prospect of further atomic bombings, and the Soviet invasion of Manchuria, Japan announced its unconditional surrender on 15 August and signed a surrender document on 2 September 1945 works best, it's a bit shorter but also keeps detail about the end of the war. DecafPotato (talk) 22:47, 3 February 2025 (UTC)

ww2 and ww1

a blood and death situaition ḀẩẠạạ ạ ạạạ 217.38.12.83 (talk) 14:01, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

Yes? What edit do you want us to make? Slatersteven (talk) 14:14, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

Summary Helps

I have been working slowly over the past couple of months on Draft:Attacks on the United States, which obviously has several entries from this war (like the attack on Pearl Harbor and the bombardment of Ellwood. If anyone familiar with one or several of the attacks against the U.S. during the war, feel free to help perfect the summaries or help by adding additional sources/references.

Any assistance is always appreciated! You can find the World War II section in the draft here: Draft:List of attacks on the United States#World War II (December 1941–September 1945). The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 21:38, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

Incorporation of the word "their" in the first paragraph

So, in the last sentence of the first paragraph "and German and Japanese leaders were tried for war crimes", Should I add their or not? HistorianofWorldHistory (talk) 11:57, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

No. That would imply that their guilt was known before they were tried. HiLo48 (talk) 16:28, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

Discussion at Talk:Pacific War § Proposed lead improvements

 You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Pacific War § Proposed lead improvements. — Goszei (talk) 23:10, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

intro much too long

@Goszei:, thanks for looking into the change of the introduction to ww2. can we please further shorten it, so it fits on a smaller screen, like maximum 2-3 paragraphs? if we are not able to do that we most likly are not able to distill any valuable information out of the article. currently most of the affected countries are in, and others not, but there is no logic behind it. that russia took baltic states and finalnd is there, croatia and greece is not there. all this little details and time order have without doubt a better home in the other article sections. --ThurnerRupert (talk) 21:56, 24 January 2025 (UTC)

Given the topic, the length of the lead is fine. Remsense ‥ 论 22:14, 24 January 2025 (UTC)

since when the summary length is depending on the topic? i am aware that web is unrestricted lenght ... but that makes it not easier to penetrate. why the intro should list that russia conquered baltic? then you d need to list 25 countries or so to be fair. then "unresolved tensions in the aftermath of" as cause, completely abstract and unpenetrable. then, "key events preceding" like mandschuria ...? arbitrary list of nonsense, or no relation without context. for the end as well, all details are there, again inpenetrable. that is low quality text. the topic is very important and really deserves better quality, at lest in the introduction. --21:36, 25 January 2025 (UTC) ThurnerRupert (talk) 21:36, 25 January 2025 (UTC)

It's quite literally the first sentence of Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Lead section § Length. Apologies, but your particular issues with the elements chosen for the lead seem to be your own, as they pretty clearly correlate to prominence in the article body to me. Remsense ‥ 论 22:00, 25 January 2025 (UTC)

Why is the Soviet Union at the top of the Allied roster in the infobox?

England was fighting the war from start to finish as the virtual Allied leader. Stalin was basically an Axis co-belligerent from 1939 to 1941, even then didn't fight against Hitler until 1941. In the Italian language wiki, the British are at the top.

It makes more sense to do three different factions in the infobox, with the Soviet Union being the third faction. Yourlocallordandsavior (talk) 07:10, 3 February 2025 (UTC)

Please see the many discussions of this topic previously: the current infobox reflects the outcomes of those discussions. Nick-D (talk) 10:22, 3 February 2025 (UTC)

Usage of "Fascist Italy" in infoboxes

Hi. The Kingdom of Italy should be restored in Template:Infobox military conflict. For example, the National Legionary State and the Kingdom of Romania under Fascism were both sub-articles for the Kingdom of Romania, but when we use it on infobox battles where Romania is involved (For example, see Operation Barbarossa, or Eastern Front), we use the Kingdom of Romania as the link and not the Kingdom of Romania under Fascism in that period. But in the case of infobox battles involving Italy, we used Fascist Italy instead of the Kingdom of Italy which is quite absurd. So in my proposition, the link of the Kingdom of Italy should be the one to be used when we are redirecting a link to it in infoboxes and not Fascist Italy, and this should be done even in the interwar period (from 1922, which the Fascist regime took control) until 1945, the end of the war (which sometimes referred the Kingdom of Italy during the Italian Campaign as the Kingdom of the South). Thanks. Jheeeeeeteegh (talk) 08:38, 3 February 2025 (UTC)

Why are "Background", "Pre-war events", and "Course of the war" all the same section?

See title. I feel like putting them all under "History" instead of making them all top-level sections makes the table of contents a lot more awkward and forces us to use a lot of low-level headers. It's not like doing so would give us too many top-level section headers; it would only increase the current 3 to 5. DecafPotato (talk) 22:50, 3 February 2025 (UTC)

I agree with your change. It's funny that I hadn't noticed the odd structure before. Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 08:46, 4 February 2025 (UTC)

I also agree that this is a good change. Nick-D (talk) 09:43, 4 February 2025 (UTC)

Social and Cultural Impact

War has had a significant impact on society and culture, including the role of women in the workforce, the effect on civilians, and the rise of propaganda. These aspects are only briefly mentioned, but could be expanded into a dedicated section. It is suggested that a new chapter entitled “Social and cultural impact” be added to explore these themes. SelimKarissa (talk) 02:14, 18 February 2025 (UTC)

The impact of World War II is currently covered in the article on the Aftermath of World War II. Dimadick (talk) 07:46, 18 February 2025 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 26 February 2025

Please can I edit this page? TecinLendoPlay (talk) 17:12, 26 February 2025 (UTC)

not an edit request. Slatersteven (talk) 17:19, 26 February 2025 (UTC)

I request more commanders added to the list

Others don't need to add that much. I want to add:

18 Russian
16 American
15 British
 7 Chinese
16 German
15 Japanese
11 Italian Ze anish (talk) 21:47, 11 March 2025 (UTC)

Don't be silly. Please also see the many previous discussions of the infobox: the current content reflects their outcomes. Nick-D (talk) 09:10, 12 March 2025 (UTC)

We have too many already. Slatersteven (talk) 11:30, 12 March 2025 (UTC)

Wait really? Ze anish (talk) 19:20, 12 March 2025 (UTC)

Per Nick-D. Cinderella157 (talk) 01:20, 13 March 2025 (UTC)